Other sorts of discussion can be really interesting, but can leave a person confused where the boundaries are. J+M+J. I think it would be a bit misleading to call this a “philosophy of quantum mechanics.” Quantum mechanics provided me an example that it is possible to provide meaningful explanations of forms of “causation” that don’t fit into deterministic models, which also convinced me that it was possible to speak meaningfully about God through analogy, even though what we mean in both cases is a bit mysterious (witness Einstein’s frustration: “God does not play dice with the universe.”).
I can’t resist asking if anyone has studied whether the philosophical implications of quantum mechanics (QM) would tend to push someone toward Thomism, Molinism, or another pole in the debate. *]Freddoso’s essay on Luis de Molina Molinism says that God provides the Grace and the person either says yes or no. The answer is “yes” to the extent that Thomism (in the narrow sense that Ghosty described) does indicate that those who are saved are predestined by God to be saved. *]Freddoso’s partial translation of Molina’s Concordia, On Divine Foreknowledge could lead to a pretty hairy blog post as a result, This resolution by way of finality, however, must also avoid the necessitating movement of grace as conceived by the Jansenists. *]Garrigou-Lagrange’s book Predestination I understand that this is a They are not the only two, however. It’s not specifically about Thomism and Molinism, but they do come up a lot, and it’s fairly easy to read: cin.org/users/james/files/tulip.htm. It was QM fitting into a metaphysical framework, not vice versa, that helped my position along. *]Father Hardon’s analysis So, we really do make real choices, and they really do affect other people, yet all of this was planned, all of this was forseen and planned for and around, and as William Lane Craig the Protestant Molinist points out, for the intent that all that might be saved, will be saved. God predestines the Saved because He dwells in Eternity, outside of time, and all moments in time are present to Him at once. Why isn't it a contradiction for the Catholic Church to accept both Thomist and Molinist doctrines. The Church upholds the authority of St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas in their teachings on grace and free will. I teach twelfth grade Moral Theology and our class recently spun out of control with a Thomist/Molinist debate on the issue of predestination and efficiency of grace. This means that the impasse found in the Thomist-Molinist divide must be overcome by a higher principle than efficient causality—namely, final causality. But I digress… Check out Miracles. So, ultimately, the controversy between the Thomists and the Molinists is a controversy about the interpretation of St. Augustine and St. Thomas. Given the practical orientation of my work–which involves defending the liberty of opinion that Catholics have rather than trying to prove one particular school of thought correct–I have not had the occasion to do that research. I wasn’t aware that there were other Catholic schools of thought, besides the Augustine, Thomist, or Molinist views. Yes? A great example of this reasoning is the fall of communist Russia. This means that our prayers at this point in time (C) are heard outside of all time, and therefore, the events necessary to occur in order for Z to happen will have been put into effect all the way back at A. I am a Molinist, since I believe that God knows what choice we will make, but He gives us free will to make our own choice. It isn’t that it is not true, but that they don’t want to be locked into Aristotle. There are other options one can arrive at while remaining in the general category of Thomist (which both Molinists and Banezian “Thomists” fall into), such as God providing enough Grace for everyone to be saved, but allowing those who do not follow it to fall away. But it would be incorrect to say that there are currently no defenders of Thomism. These aren’t the only two possibilities, not even from reading Aquinas’ arguments, but they were the two that clashed head to head in a famous theological controversy that ended in a draw. Then again, the materialist will argue that Karol’s parents brought him into existence and circumstances (such as the loss of his parents and the multiple invasions of his homeland) brought about the mindset that would be set on bringing down “the evil empire” (even though he was not the only person in all of history to have experienced those same circumstances, but he was the only one to do something incredible about it). I just read it, and it is excellent.

God bless. Thomism does not teach that man has no say in the matter; or that his choice does not affect his salvation. Molinism is a school that is part of Thomism in the general sense (it originated in commentaries to Aquinas), yet it must be born in mind that, here, Thomism and Molinism oppose each other. Scripture and Tradition allow us to establish certain points, such as the absolute necessity of grace for anyone to be saved, but they may not allow us to fully exhaust the mystery that we are confronted with here, just as they allow us to establish certain points regarding the nature of God without exhausting the mystery that he is. I’ve heard this from modern Dominicans as well; Molinists are considered “Thomistic” in the broader sense of the term, as opposed to the narrow use of “Thomist” refering to a specific school of Thomistic thinkers of the day. This also means that there is no way to successfully debate divine providence from natural order, when it comes to “everyday miracles” or “special Providence” (that is, “miraculous” answers to the prayers of a single person or group of people). The heart of Molinism is the principle that God is completely sovereign and man is also free in a libertarian sense. But the more he immersed himself in Scripture the more he found to support the Catholic faith, and in 1992 he entered the Catholic Church. I understand the Thomist/Molinist debate as being primarily based on Cajetan’s version of St. Thomas’s doctrine of analogy, which I believe to be different than what St. Thomas himself had in mind. Based on your post above, I think that you would really enjoy a book called “Modern Physics and Ancient Faith” by Stephen Barr. Answer: Molinism is named for the 16th-century Jesuit, Luis de Molina. The Thomist position, as proposed by Banez as opposed to the more general principles laid out by Aquinas, holds to a cooperation with Grace on the part of man, but it’s very, very weak in describing just how this plays out. Molinism says that God provides the Grace and the person either says yes or no.

I just can’t fit the New Advent definitions of Molinism and Thomism in my pea sized brain. Question: "What is Molinism and is it biblical?" I think one can be a Deppist and Jimmist at the same time. They both say God provides the grace but man must correspond. This is the one that I always thought of as being closest to physics. – Best Apologetics Blog God’s universal salvific will is the idea that God desires that all men be saved (1 Timothy 2:4, 2 Peter 3:9). It’s also worth remembering that one standard Molinist contention — from the very beginning — is that Thomas Aquinas’s view of predestination leads to Molinism and not to Thomism, which would be perhaps better called Banezianism, after Domingo Banez, one of the great commentators on Aquinas; and that the dispute between the two groups sometimes had as much to do with the … but I was simply curious. Thomas, Speaking of which, just a saw a little gem: Benny and Joon (1993?). Therefore God knows every single person who is saved “before” it happens, though in reality there is no “before” or “after” with God; He simply sees all things as they are, and He sees all moments at once. Thomas, The article, which I’ve read before, seems to confirm that Thomism shares at least some ideas with Calvinism. For an exhaustive discussion of this topic i.e.

This is not often appreciated in some circles. Whereas with Molinism one’s salvation is more dependant on whether the individual chooses to cooperate with God’s Grace. Molinists stress God’s universal salvific will, and Thomists (or Banezians) stress divine universal causation.

God grants us the freedom to accept or reject Him, but He is omniscient, so He knows what choice we will make. For example, many of the key terms connected with salvation–"redemption," "justification," "sanctification," and even "salvation" itself–occur in Scripture with more than one meaning. At the same time, one could say that the future is predestined by causes originating outside of nature but nevertheless determining the result of each observation. I do not believe that mankind is an automaton that is forced to have faith or not.
The Catholic positions are also inevitably much more theologically rigorous.

The popes, although leaning initially heavily in favor of the Thomist resolution, which favored more literally Augustinian conclusions, nonetheless decided not to intervene and to forbid both parties from characterizing the other as heretical. Jimmy was born in Texas, grew up nominally Protestant, but at age 20 experienced a profound conversion to Christ. I need something a 4th grader can understand. That is, they are motivated by some of the same factors, but Arminianism and Calvinism are very much further apart than Molinism and Thomism. Jimmy: Given the practical orientation of my work–which involves defending the liberty of opinion that Catholics have rather than trying to prove one particular school of thought correct The theological claims of the Protestant Reformers, especially the unbending views of John Calvin, made such … The fact that the alphabet runs from A to Z is both a natural occurance (in that one logically follows the next), but is also a miraculous event, in that God ordained (or even pre-ordained) it so. I was just wondering whether you were a Thomist,

The traditional Catholic theologian is strongly committed to both of these doctrines. Yay I sure wish I;d sen this thread before I posted my poll last week. Planning on becoming a Protestant seminary professor, he started an intensive study of the Bible. Here are some sources that may be helpful (in increasing order according to difficulty and length): [LIST=1]

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